Packing Light: Ditch the Nalgenes!

Packing Light: Ditch the Nalgenes!

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Overview

Ok... this is about a lot more than ditching Nalgene bottles, but how do you get your pack under ten pounds? Is it worth it?

Over the past two or three years I have had a sort of competition with myself to see just how light I can get my pack… without skipping any desirable gear. Obviously there are many different approaches and styles to heading out into the wilderness, and for some it may not be worth leaving those extra layers, toasty sleeping bag, down pillow, camp slippers, or four room tent behind if you are heading to Thousand Island Lake for a multi-day weekend with the family, dog, and fishing gear to set up a nice base camp for enjoyment of the mosquitoes.

All too often, however, I have seen folks struggling in agony under insufferable loads trying to do far more, even hauling heavy gear on long and strenuous outings like the 210 mile John Muir Trail or 6000 feet up Taboose Pass… this isn’t necessary!!!

When I did the John Muir Trail seven years ago I thought I was packing light, but I wasn’t even close. We struggled under huge loads. And after food resupplies we even had to help each other put our packs on. My empty pack alone weighed six pounds! As I have tried out new gear and leaving other gear behind I have amazed myself with how much more I am capable of doing with a lighter pack. And I don't miss my extra gear!

No longer is a base camp necessary or even justified, I can just haul everything I have straight up to the summit and down the other side to continue my journey. More remote areas can be reached far more quickly, in just part of a day even… and still I have everything I need. With lighter loads I’ve found I have more time to enjoy the destination rather than the approach. And it feels so sweet when my pack is so light I needn’t even bother with a hip belt (for me this point seems to be under 11-12 pounds).

And did I mention the benefits of fitting all your gear into a daypack? Permits… Well you don’t need a wilderness permit if you only have a daypack do you?

My normal base load had finally gotten below ten pounds… and yes… it has been worth it.

First… Weigh Your Gear!

 
Scale
Post Lake Italy Pack Weight

Weighing gear should be obvious enough, but too many don’t think about just what that 3 pound sleeping bag is doing to them, or compare the weight of new gear before buying it. The first thing I always look at is the weight… then the price. There is no point in buying new gear if it is going to be too heavy to use comfortably or long term.

Only very recently I discovered that I could shave another 1/2 pound off my pack weight by ditching my previous standard of two lightweight thermal tops for a single heavier weight one. The loss in flexibility is slight, but well worth another 5% in weight savings. And at night I am just as warm as I was before.

Also… invest in a portable scale.
I weigh my pack before and after every trip. When you unpack pay particular attention to any gear or food that you did not use. Consider dumping it next time. Also note that when I refer to pack weights here I am usually referring to the weight after the trip. If you eat all the food you brought then fair enough… it doesn’t count!

Too many times folks talk in generalities, and I will try to cover that, but also list at lot of the gear I use so you can see exactly how I made it work.

So on to some specifics…

Sleeping Gear

 
Sleeping Gear
Sleeping Gear and JetBoil

This is first because this is where most folks I meet have a HUGE opportunity to reduce weight.

Sleeping pad
Therm-a-Rest NeoAir XLite Small
Measured weight 8 ounces

I cut no corners here. When you can use the same gear every single trip it’s worth going all out for it.

This pad 2.5 inches thick, comfortable, and warm enough for me to use year-round, even in the snow. More importantly, the NeoAir XLite doesn’t have foam insulation (it has more efficient reflective layers) so it packs super small, which helps you reduce your backpack size too. Like you will see in many areas the weight savings can compound itself. Smaller pad… smaller pack. So you save more than just the weight of the pad.

And get the short pad. Use your empty backpack to place under your feet when you sleep. The idea is to have multiple uses for everything… it is a bit useless for your pack to be lying next to you doing nothing each night. Use it for part of your sleeping pad and your pack will be 4-8 ounces lighter every trip you take simply because you don’t have a long sleeping pad.

Sleeping bag
Mountain Hardwear Mountain Speed 32 degree bag
Measured weight 16 ounces

DOWN! Ditch the old synthetic bag and by the lightest down that fits your budget. I recently upgraded to this bag and this was a key step to finally keep me under 10 pounds longer in the season. It has 850-fill down and a super light shell. Pricey but I can use this bag on nearly every trip. Even better it packs down to almost a liter, again enabling even more weight savings since I can now use an even smaller and lighter pack.

Previously my normal bag was a 40 degree REI version which still worked for most of the year. Sleep in ALL your clothes, and you will be surprised at how warm a sleeping bag you can deal with. Again… a complete waste if your clothes are piled up next to you while you are snuggled up in a 0 or 20 degree bag. Wear two pairs of socks if your feet are cold. Maybe wrap your feet in your shell jacket as well. Maybe you use one layer for a pillow, but everything else should be worn or wrapped around you all night.

LEAVE AT HOME
Pillow. Use one of your existing layers.

Shelter

 
Lewis Creek Camp
BetaLight doing well in the snow at Grouse Lake in Kings Canyon

Tent
Black Diamond Beta Light
Measured weight 23 ounces (including 6 stakes)

Again, depending on where you live, sooooo much weight can be saved here. The Beta Light is perhaps the best purchase I have ever made, and it works great in most seasons (including many winter conditions). 60 mph winds aren’t ideal for this tent, but unless you are camping on a summit that is rarely a consideration. I have used it throughout the Sierra and much of the Cascades and been through snow, hail, and rain… all without any problems.

The tent is plenty big enough for two people, larger than many two person tents, but is light enough to be ideal for one. It uses trekking poles to save on weight, and it is floorless so I use a lightweight ground tarp to protect my gear and keep it clean.

Ground Tarp
Gossamer Gear Polycryo Ground Cloth
Measured weight 1.7 ounces each

My props to SP member Marmaduke for turning me on to this item. No heavy tarp needed. I’ve used one of these sheets for two years without having to replace it (ok… after two years a marmot finally went after mine, so now I am on my second version). Thin, lightweight, and very surprisingly durable. It looks like it doesn't last, but it does. One medium sheet works perfect for each person who might be using a floorless tent.

Trekking Poles
Black Diamond Trail Trekking Pole
18 ounces per pair

I list this under Shelter because this isn’t really gear that I consider part of my pack weight, yet I am able to utilize them for the Beta Light while I am in camp.

There are many options available here, but for me this is the best model available. Carbon fiber is lighter but I would suspect not as durable given the abuse I put mine through (using them as sort of an ice ax for stability on spring snow for example or as a brake when glissading). I like the foam handles, they collapse to be about as compact as any model out there, and the FlickLock mechanism is FAR superior to models that require twisting, especially in wet or freezing conditions… they never wear out!

Note again, however, that as I carry these in my hands and they are rarely in my pack, I haven’t included these in my pack weight.

Bivy
REI Minimalist Bivy Sack
Measured weight 16 ounces

Alternatively, an extra half pound or more can be saved if going solo by using a bivy sack instead of a tent shelter and the associated stakes that go along with it. This model is super light and relatively inexpensive and works great for ridge traverses or summit bivies. It has a mesh face cover, so not ideal for extended rain... but you will survive (can always turn over or use your jacket shell as a cover). The Black Diamond Twilight Bivy is even lighter (10 ounces) and has a full top cover, but I have no experience with this model yet.

EDIT: Just since writing this I have now had the experience of waiting out a nighttime snowstorm in the Minimalist Bivy mentioned above. It was not a good experience. Really this bivy is just good for ideal weather (and in that case you don't need a bivy at all). I have since returned it an will probably look at the Black Diamond version or some similar alternative.

LEAVE AT HOME
Heavy tarp or tent footprint, full size tent, tent floor

Clothing

Simple really… just don’t bring more than you need. No need for that extra layer than you might only wear for only 20 minutes after sunset. Why carry something around all day if you are barely going to use it? Also if you can afford it, replace that fleece jacket with a down one.


ItemWeightComments
Sun hat2 ounces
Warm hat2 ouncesAlways bring this, excellent warmth for the weight
Neck gaiter1.5 ouncesAlso weighs only a little but can add a ton of warmth either on the move or when sleeping
Lightweight gloves2 ouncesOften optional
Spare socks2 ouncesI usually bring one extra pair, and often wear both when I am sleeping
Towel0.7 ouncesOK this is extraneous, but I often take a washcloth sized towel (nothing larger). Tiny but still good enough for after a dip in a cold lake or for wiping condensation or frost off the tent.
Thermal bottoms5 ouncesGood in the morning/evenings and generally I wear them in the sleeping bag.
Top base layer11 ouncesJust recently I shaved another 5 ounces off my switching from two lightweight layers to a single midweight layer.
Down sweater12 ouncesI have a Patagonia Down Sweater for my main layer, and if colder than normal I might bring either an additional base layer top or a Mountain Hardwear Ghost Whisperer down jacket as well.
Hardshell jacket13 ouncesI use a Marmot PreCip Rain Jacket (after using a softshell for years). When going light, use a hardshell, always lighter and more compact. If the weather warrants this can frequently be skipped altogether for large weight savings, or use a lighter option.


LEAVE AT HOME
Crocs, spare pants, extra shirts, flip flops, spare layer for ‘just in case’ (you can surely get by without those layers you seldom put on, or only wear briefly before bed)

Food

This is up to you, the main thing is to eat everything and not have any leftovers. Anything you don’t eat is not only waste, but dead weight carried throughout the trip. Bring food you like and will eat, and ditch the stove!

I take a stove if going on a 4+ day trip, or 3 days with others and sharing the weight. But otherwise it is just too much gear for 1-2 nights. Sandwiches, burritos, pizza, wraps, granola bars, Snickers bars, cheese and crackers… there are plenty of options for leaving the stove behind. Mountain House even has a chicken salad meal that only uses cold water. Dropping the stove will save 1-2 pounds easily… remember no matter how light the stove you have to consider the weight of the pot and fuel too!

I carefully weigh my food before every trip. As long as I am bringing high caloric food like peanut butter and jelly sandwiches I know I can get by with about 2.5 pounds of food on an overnight trip, and 4 or 6 pounds for a 2 or 3 night trip respectively. If I have food with extra water content like a burrito (full of rice or beans) I probably need to up the amount by a half pound or so.

It doesn't really matter specifically what you bring for each meal, just keep an eye on the total weight and it usually works out to be enough, without a lot of leftovers.

Sometimes a stove is needed for longer trips, or melting snow. In these cases I use a regular model Jetboil. There are lighter versions available now, but I don’t carry the stove often enough to justify the expense for a better model.

LEAVE AT HOME
Stove

Other Gear

 
Overnight Gear
Paddles Sorting my Gear in Kings Canyon National Park

On every trip there is a small pile of tiny items that must be brought. Here is an outline of what I bring along:

Water containers
Empty Gatorade Bottle and Platypus 34 ounce SoftBottle
Measured weight 1.4 and 1 ounce respectively

FORGET THE NALGENE!!! Nalgenes are heavy!!! OK... finally to the title of the article... over 2000 words in. The hard sided bottles are over 6 ounces each… when empty! This is dead weight, and if you carry 2 or 3 it is a lot of dead weight. Nearly everyone I've met can save weight here. Gatorade bottles work just as well and weigh about an ounce. You can replace them cheaply instead of worrying about cleaning them when they get dirty (or use them as a pee bottle if you can’t be bothered to leave your tent one night). I use a 20 ounce bottle but 32 ounce ones are great too.

If additional capacity is needed for detours to summits or snowmelt, a lightweight Platypus bottle works (no tubes or fancy tops). Many of my friends say the Platypus bottles leak, but if you take care of them and do not fold them up they last for years.


Headlamp
Black Diamond Spot Headlamp
Measured weight 3.5 ounces with batteries

First, I use rechargeable batteries. This allows me to begin every trip with a full charge on my headlamp and eliminates any need to carry extra batteries. The headlamp is incredibly bright, 90 lumens (whatever that means), and has lot of modes including a spotlight, red light, dimmer, and you can lock the device to prevent accidentally turning it on in your pack. By the way… when I say incredibly bright… I mean it.

Knife
Victorinox Swiss Army Silver Alox
Measured weight 0.5 ounces

No need for a machete. Includes scissors, knife, file, and screwdriver tip in less than an ounce.

Sunscreen
1.25 oz refillable GoToob bottle
Measured weight 2.5 ounces with sunscreen

I purchased a refillable 1.25 oz GoToob bottle from REI. Much cheaper to by sunscreen in large 8-10 ounce tubes and put only what is needed in a smaller container. 1.25 ounces has always been plenty for a long weekend, even in the snow. No need to carry a 4-5 ounce tube along. I’ll also carry a small stick of chapstick.

Duct Tape
Measured weight 0.6 ounces

I carry a small amount of duct tape everywhere, usually to tape my feet and prevent blisters. Could also be useful to repair gear or as temporary first aid assistance. To keep it down to what I need, I just wrap the duct tape around an empty toilet paper roll and cut the roll down to size. Add to the roll as needed after each trip.

Toiletries
Toilet paper, toothbrush, toothpaste, floss
Measured weight 2.3 ounces

Toilet paper… just pull some off a roll and stick it in a ziplock bag. Shouldn’t need a whole roll. Also a tiny container of Purell (see Water Filter comments below).
Toothbrush with a shaved off handle (mostly so it fits in a ziplock rather than the weight savings)
Ultra tiny toothpaste tube (can get these from hotels or airlines (in business class). I refill the tiny tubes using my regular toothpaste at home
Floss (piece by piece in a ziplock, no need to take the whole container)
Sometimes a tiny bit of soap or shampoo


Map
Negligible weight

Instead of a big national park or forest map that covers a huge area (some of these are over a couple of ounces), I just print out what I need using TOPO! software from National Geographic. There are many other mechanisms too, but a printout on a sheet of paper often works about as good as anything and has more detail than a large, bulky map.

Cord
Measured weight 1 ounce
A pair of extra shoelaces or some short cord to secure food away from marmots and mice. See Bear Can notes below.

Alarm
Measured weight 0.4 ounces

Since I usually don’t have a phone (see below) and I don’t wear a watch, I have a small, cheap Casio that I can use for an alarm. OK… I paid more than I should have… but I wanted pink.

Items to Leave at Home

 
Bear along Bubbs Creek
Bear on Bubbs Creek Trail in Kings Canyon National Park...
Not an area to ditch the bear can!!!

Water filter
Ditching this depends on where you go, but if you are concerned about pathogens you are definitely better off sanitizing your hands after making a deposit in the woods than worrying about contaminated water. Too often I see people expending tons of effort preparing water, then doing nothing about their own filthy hands. A small container of Purell is less than an ounce and you can refill it from a cheaper, larger container.

Also note that by ditching the water filter you no longer need to carry any water (a HUGE weight savings). Since water can be taken immediately at any source, seldom do I need to carry more than 20 ounces even if I am heading up a route where water may not be available. In fact, at least 90% of the time I carry no water at all.

ADDITION: Sometimes traveling through areas with questionable water quality cannot be avoided, or perhaps when visiting a new area some backup is desired. On trips lasting a week or longer where you might be visiting all kinds of areas it may not be worth the extra weight for a filter that might be necessary for just a few uses (assuming the majority of your sources are clean).

An alternative to using a filter I have relied on for these just-in-case situations is to use Potable Aqua Iodine and Taste-Neutralizer Tablets. This is a fairly cheap method and though they come in glass bottles you can carry a few pills in a small Ziploc bag and it weighs nothing. Chlorine dioxide tablets are another near weightless alternative (suggested by cyffredinol in the comments... my thanks to her for the suggestion and the reminder on these alternatives to filters).

I have gone for years without using these or any other filtering method without any issues, but on a recent trip to the southern Sierra where cattle grazing is permitted I took the iodine pills along. About half the time I was able to find springs and drink water untreated. Otherwise I used the iodine and it worked well, and the taste neutralizer was effective. It even removed the iodine color!


First Aid Kit
I carried a small ziplock bag with some bandages and tape in it for years, but now I don’t carry one… I rarely used it. Bandages are trivial items, bring them if you think you need them, but you can often improvise for such minor injuries. If anything serious happens you can use clothing, duct tape, or other items you have with you. You don’t need to be prepared to place sutures while you are out in the backcountry. If something serious happens… stabilize the situation and leave immediately or get help. If it isn’t serious... well... then it isn’t serious is it?!!!

Bear Can
These are 2-3 pounds… WAY too heavy. Sometimes you may need one, (i.e. if you are spending the weekend at Woods Creek in Kings Canyon) but if up above treeline this is unnecessary gear. I’ve gone out for years and never had a problem with bears getting my food. Just don’t camp in heavily trafficked areas… it is more enjoyable that way anyway! Instead I just bring a couple of shoelaces or some short cord. Use this to hang your food off a rock so mice and marmots can’t get to it, or while offtrail and on the move it can be useful to lower your pack down a difficult area.

But what about canister requirements? Again, savings in one area help compound savings in another. Now that you can fit all your gear into a daypack, no one will be looking for a bear can right?

Going light and fast, and staying above the crowds, rangers, and animals is often the good way to go.

Phone
I’ll take a phone on some trips, but if there is no reception or I need to go ultra light this can be left behind. Many phones weigh over 5 ounces!

GPS
These are heavy (with batteries), and with good map reading skills they should be unnecessary. Heading through the woods in the winter is different, but often a GPS is extraneous. In some cases it may be worth bringing a small compass… these are much lighter and they always work!

Pack Cover
This usually isn’t necessary. If concerned about the down gear and clothing a small drybag or even a ziplock can be usefull and generally weighs less than an ounce. If the forecast is poor there are plenty of light methods to keep your bag and clothing dry. I have a 20 liter Outdoor Research UltraLight Dry Sack and it weighs less than 2 ounces.

Backpack

This is where it all pays off. By using lightweight and low volume gear and leaving behind what you don’t need, your pack can become dramatically smaller and lighter too. Lightweight and compact gear, especially with respect to your sleeping pad, tent, and sleeping pad can double your weight savings by enabling you to use a much smaller pack. And while most gear tends to get more expensive as you go lighter, the lower volume packs cost less too!

Pack
REI Stoke 29
24 ounces

Currently my normal overnight pack is a REI Stoke 29, advertised as a daypack, weighing in at 24 ounces. Although there are smaller and lighter options available, the padding starts to get a little thin in other versions. Still… I am currently on the lookout for my next pack. I can usually fit crampons, gaiters, and/or a stove in the pack if I need to.

For larger outing where a rope, harness, or other gear may be needed I use a recently acquired Osprey Talon 44. At 2 pounds and 7 ounces there are lighter options available, but I've found it to be a pretty fair balance between padding and weight for when the additional gear is needed.

Snow Gear

 
Pack and Snow Gear
Backpack and Lightweight Snow Gear on Eagle Scout Peak

Sometimes you can’t get away with leaving gear behind, but you needn’t be prepared for a run up Cassin Ridge if your real objective is to get up a simple snow couloir and over a Sierra pass. Two pieces of gear I’ve found very useful in many situations, and weigh very little:

Crampons
Grivel Air Tech Light Crampons
Measured weight 21 ounces

These will fit will on most any boot or shoe. Not great for blue ice but I have used these on solid snow slopes exceeding 45 degrees. They are far more versatile than Kahtoola Microspikes, but a bit heavier overall. And they aren’t needed on every trip anyway.

Ice Axe
CAMP USA Corsa Nanotech Ice Axe
Measured weight 9 ounces

Far lighter than most ice axe alternatives, even half the weight of some. This makes it much more realistic to carry an axe if you may only need it for a short distance or aren’t sure of the conditions, and it also works well as a second axe when doing moderate glacier routes. I’ve yet to bring this item along without one of my partners being jealous!

Total Pack Weight

So what does it all add up too?

GearItemWeight
Sleeping padTherm-a-Rest NeoAir XLite Small8 ounces
Sleeping bagMountain Hardwear Mountain Speed 32 degree bag16 ounces
TentBlack Diamond Beta Light and stakes23 ounces
Ground TarpGossamer Gear Polycryo Ground Cloth1.7 ounces
ClothingSun hat, Warm hat, Neck gaiter, Lightweight gloves, Spare socks, Pack towel10.2 ounces
Long underwearOne bottom layer and one midweight top layer16 ounces
Down sweaterPatagonia Down Sweater12 ounces
Hardshell jacketMarmot PreCip Rain Jacket13 ounces
Water containersEmpty Gatorade Bottle and Platypus 32 ounce SoftBottle2.4 ounces
HeadlampBlack Diamond Spot Headlamp and batteries3.5 ounces
KnifeVictorinox Swiss Army Silver Alox0.5 ounces
Sunscreen1.25 oz GoToob bottle and chapstick2.5 ounces
ToiletriesToilet Paper, Toothbrush, Toothpaste, Floss2.3 ounces
Other ItemsDuct Tape, Map, Cord, Alarm2 ounces
BackpackREI Stoke 29 daypack24 ounces
Total weight..... 8 pounds 9.1 ounces


In practice my total pack weight has never actually been below 9.0-9.5 pounds so far... usually there is an extra item or two, and there is the packaging from food eaten that I include, wet clothes, sometimes an extra layer, maybe spare underwear, or even a kite on some trips! But staying under 10 pounds is often possible.

And do you really need anything else?

Oh yeah… your wilderness permit… maybe…


Comments

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Viewing: 21-40 of 51
mrchad9

mrchad9 - Oct 1, 2013 1:15 pm - Hasn't voted

Re: Exhaustive

Ah good! I hope it is useful!

I keep thinking of little tidbits I need to add... things I take for granted... like not taking a bunch of keys with you (just the car key)... maybe some food details... little things.

Get your own pack weight down and its a lot easier to carry all the kid's gear too!

Bubba Suess

Bubba Suess - Oct 1, 2013 11:38 pm - Voted 10/10

Re: Exhaustive

The kids gear...yeah, that stinks. We did an easy overnighter this year at Cliff Lake. It was a bit of a challenge with the baby, but it was fun. I cheated on this one though because we pushed the 'bob' stroller in with Laramie in it but we loaded it down with gear too. Carson is one thing but a baby is a different matter all together.

I noticed you did not mention your camera in your list of gear. Have you weighed it?

mrchad9

mrchad9 - Oct 2, 2013 4:07 pm - Hasn't voted

Re: Exhaustive

Camera doesn't count!

I think mine weighs about 5 ounces. I don't really count the camera though because one thing I do after each trip is photograph the pack weight, so can't really include the camera when I am doing that. Also if I have gotten it light enough I usually do not use the hip belt on the hike out, once the food is gone. When that is the case I move the camera pouch from the shoulder strap to my belt anyway just for comfort, so it is no longer in the pack anyway.

But I do stick to point and shoot cameras just for the weight savings. All the camera gear is probably nice sometimes, but not worth the cost or the effort to me. Too many pics already!

2 Bees

2 Bees - Oct 7, 2013 10:01 pm - Voted 10/10

Weight

You are spot on 100% on weighting everything and after every trip, if you did not use it, loose it. I use my GOPRO camera/video. My Deuter pack is lighter, but my Wide Country does not hurt my back after 5 days from carrying my touring ski's = 12 lbs.( pack's=1 lbs. diff. ). Only in winter times, I had problems with my gatorade bottle. My water filter is a small steam 100 yards long moving slow through rocks. 38 years on the trails/mts. and not sick once. I carry no phone, but in the winter, on snow, in a new area, I will carry a GPS. 2 lbs. of food a day; you eat well; I'am half that. You have me beat hands down on total weight, my pack weight runs at 19 lbs. for 5 days with food only. Off to weight things and see what can be replaced or left behind. Good Post mrchad9.

*My oops! Never say never. I will heat the water to 160F for 5 minutes if up above the creek or lake has been used - trail, humans or animals or I'll use my Sawyer filter and the liquid two part Aquamira drops if it's real bad and I need water.

mrchad9

mrchad9 - Oct 8, 2013 12:43 pm - Hasn't voted

Re: Weight

19 pounds for a 5 day trip is not bad at all! I think I might come in at about 17... counting all the food. 9 pounds of pack plus 8 of food. Maybe another pound if I need a larger pack to contain all the food though. But if you are eating a pound per day then that's great, maybe some more gear that can be optimized. Also I think of it more as food per night, rather than per day (double the food for a 2 night 3 day as a 1 night 2 day trip).

Since doing all this it has helped me greatly. As you note extra gear is sometimes needed, but if you know exactly what it weighs and what your tradeoff is (4 oz for GPS or 5 for an extra layer for example, or if considering a more comfortable pack) then it helps make those decisions too.

Thank you so much for your comment. I appreciate it and hope the article provides some benefits or ideas!
Chad

cyffredinol

cyffredinol - Oct 8, 2013 9:20 pm - Hasn't voted

back to the filter debate...

You're definitely correct that washing or sanitizing your hands after pooping and before eating is a good idea. But I gotta agree with nartreb that this won't protect you from bacteria or protozoa in unfiltered water. If a filter is too heavy, chlorine dioxide tablets weigh hardly anything and will purify water. Though they don't taste great, I'd rather put up with that than risk getting Giardia.
Great article, though!

mrchad9

mrchad9 - Oct 9, 2013 1:23 pm - Hasn't voted

Re: back to the filter debate...

Thanks so much for your comment and suggestion cyffredinol!

Of course you are correct... it is just that in the areas I am in I generally do not believe there is any risk of pathogens in the drinking water. But certainly this doesn't apply to everyone in all areas. Tablets are a great idea and a lightweight alternative to filters if there is a concern. I made an addition to the article based on your suggestion. Thanks for your feedback!

kevinsa

kevinsa - Oct 9, 2013 1:52 am - Voted 10/10

Beat me to it!

Great article - I actually had plans to post something very similar. A few of my humble opinions to stir up some more conversation: 1. 12 point crampons are almost never necessary (unless ice climbing). I did Rainier last year in my six points with no issues. 2. 24oz seems a little on the heavy side for an ultralight pack - my Golite comes in at about 19oz, and I know there's lighter ones out there. 3. The most important place to slash weight is on your feet. Various studies have shown a pound on the feet to be the equivalent of 4.7-6.4 lbs. on the back. I made the switch to trail runners for backpacking and mountain approaches years ago, and it effectively doubled my range. Well, I'll keep the rest of my stupid opinions to myself - thanks for an outstanding article.

mrchad9

mrchad9 - Oct 9, 2013 1:36 pm - Hasn't voted

Re: Beat me to it!

Great suggestions kevinsa! Please don’t hesitate to write something similar on your own… I would love to read the complete thoughts of you or anyone else. By combining ideas from multiple sources folks can identify what works for them and find more and more opportunities to optimize their total pack weight. The more opinions the better. I was surprised to find there was nothing like this on SP after all these years, would be good if there were more.

What brand and model of crampons do you use and what do they weigh? I’d be interested in checking them out. If you used them on Rainier I assume they are steel and not aluminum?

Certainly my pack is not the lightest around. I noted in the article even that I am looking for something new. But I think it is all about tradeoffs and knowing exactly what you are spending (in terms of weight) on each item. For me so far I just haven’t found a pack I like that shaves off the right number of ounces for the right change in comfort. I’m sure it is out there, and the best pack option for weight vs comfort is likely different for most every individual.

I’ve heard similar things on footwear. Perhaps I need to look into that more, but the type of outings I do are usually pretty hard on the feet. Not always on the trail, lots of talus and scree. The ankle support, extra height to keep debris out, and bit of extra padding on the ankles and sides for where I go is helpful. Maybe I should try to do something different on some trips though.

Hope to see something you might write sometime... really!

kevinsa

kevinsa - Oct 10, 2013 6:14 pm - Voted 10/10

Re: Beat me to it!

The crampons I have been using are Hillsound Cypress 6. They are steel, and weigh 1.12 lbs. Not super light compared to aluminum, but they allow me to use lighter boots that do not have full shanks. They are also incredibly easy to put on and take off.

I decided to do a quick comparison of two of my past Rainier trips. In 1994, we did the Disappointment Cleaver route (considered the easiest), and I wore the following on my feet: Plastic boots - 5.80 lbs., OR gaiters - 0.68 lbs., 12 point crampons - 2.06 lbs. Total weight on the feet minus socks - 8.54 lbs. In 2012, we did the Emmons-Winthrop route (a bit longer than the DC route), and I wore the following on my feet: Normal hiking boots - 3.20 lbs, light weight gaiters - 0.20 lbs, and 6 point crampons - 1.12 lbs. Total weight on the feet minus socks - 4.52 lbs. Using conventional wisdom, that should equate to the equivalent of a 20 lb. pack reduction. How did it work in practice?

In 1994 (21 years old at the time), we spent three days on the DC route. When we got done, I was completely spent. In 2012, we did the Emmons/Winthrop route in 23 hours (including the overnight), and when we were done, I felt great (age 39, BTW). Granted, my gear was a little better, and my pack a little lighter, but I'll still let those results speak for themselves!

mrchad9

mrchad9 - Oct 14, 2013 1:30 pm - Hasn't voted

Re: Beat me to it!

Thanks for the info on the crampons. I had been considering some steel strap-ons so I have more flexibility in boots... currently I have the aluminum ones (which I love for the right situations) or steel step ins. Your suggestion might be a better in between than what I was considering.

Yeah boots make a huge difference. I haven't been able to go down to trail runners, but I ditched my plastic boots a good while ago. I hate those things!

mrchad9

mrchad9 - Oct 9, 2013 1:43 pm - Hasn't voted

Re: Go lite, but not too lite....

My gear has worked well over many seasons in the High Sierra, I think folks overdo it on layers sometimes… I do as well. I made an addition for some suggestions on filter alternatives (using iodine or chlorine dioxide tablets which weigh much less). But I haven’t used anything for nearly every outing for many years without issue.

I use a 32 degree bag down to about 20 degrees at night and have found that if I am in the right number of layers it isn’t an issue. I have heavier bags for more serious winter outings though.

I don’t plan on soaking layers while I am on the move though… if I am sweating then some layers need to come off… wear one noninsulating layer at most in those situations. As long as I have a shelter or bivy and the 32 deg bag with me I’ve been able to ride out any storms or cold weather. I was hit by a surprise snowstorm a couple of weeks ago. I had an extra insulating layer but had ditched my shell. Wasn’t always comfortable but was plenty safe and able to ride it out with the bag and other gear I had. Thanks for the comment!

ywardhorner

ywardhorner - Oct 9, 2013 3:55 pm - Hasn't voted

Good article!

I thought I was pretty good at going light, but I have to admit I never thought about Nalgene bottles! I always carry an old one in the winter to use as a pee bottle cuz there's no way I'm getting out of the tent in the middle of the night. Now that you mention it, an old Gatorade bottle would make much more sense. Thanks for the idea!

As far as soaking layers goes -- I always soak the back of my top (the part that's under my pack), even in cool weather, but I don't carry a spare. I stick to fabrics that I know will dry in 15-20 mins.

mrchad9

mrchad9 - Oct 10, 2013 12:20 pm - Hasn't voted

Re: Good article!

I agree.... cotton kills!

I am glad the bottle suggestion might help out. Yeah I feel much better about tossing a Gatorade pee bottle in the trash than I do carrying it home with me!

mountainsandsound

mountainsandsound - Oct 9, 2013 8:09 pm - Hasn't voted

good ideas

Some good ideas in this article. I have enjoyed pushing myself to go lighter and lighter over the past couple years and it actually feels pretty thrilling at times.

Unfortunately, for many trips the weight that I save by omitting gear is made up for in beer. So my pack isn't really that much lighter in the end.

mrchad9

mrchad9 - Oct 10, 2013 12:21 pm - Hasn't voted

Re: good ideas

Glad you liked the article. Well maybe if you can shave off an extra few ounces then an additional beer can be added? So there is still a payoff.

mountainsandsound

mountainsandsound - Oct 10, 2013 6:24 pm - Hasn't voted

Re: good ideas

Yes, my pack still comes out lighter in the end. But not as light as it could be, because I am too tempted to throw some cans of Rainier in the empty space at the top of my pack. Maybe a smaller pack would fix that problem.

I had no idea that a Nalgene was that heavy.

goldenhopper

goldenhopper - Oct 10, 2013 2:27 am - Hasn't voted

Jardine influence?

Haha! Good stuff Chad. You covered just about everything. I read beyond Backpacking in 2001 and started to go light in 2002. I've found a comfort zone at my 14 pound base pack weight. My pack is very similar to yours, but I do like to eat hot meals no matter the length of the trip via an Esbit stove and 2L titanium pot. In the end I've found that less is more. Aside from not hauling the extra weight, I find it a better wilderness experience to make things as simple as possible; using the lanscape and my head as much as possible. My new pet peeve is someone with their Apple headphones surgically attached to their ears as they meander through the wilderness. FFS!

mrchad9

mrchad9 - Oct 10, 2013 12:26 pm - Hasn't voted

Re: Jardine influence?

Thanks goldenhopper. Yeah I also dislike the use of electronics in the wilderness. Some can't get away from it though.

Hot food is nice too... as long as you know the tradeoff and I think weighing everything helps and then you can decide is the stover or extra layer or whatever worth X many more ounces. Sounds like you have that covered... 14 pounds is much lighter than the average person out there.

I also agree that by not taking so much gear out there it is more of a wilderness experience. I don't want to feel like I'm in a campground when I am backbacking. The less I can get by with the more I feel like I belong out there.

mountainsandsound

mountainsandsound - Oct 10, 2013 6:38 pm - Hasn't voted

for mountaineering?

This seems geared toward backpacking. I'd be curious about how you apply this philosophy to Shasta trips. I have been leaving the tent behind more often during quick, fair weather trips, and on my most recent Shasta trip my brother and I went with a go-lite tarp tent, which we ultimately did not set up. It was a fun, exposed (to the elements, not to falls) bivy near the toe of the Hotlum.

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