''Would it be better just to use AT boots with overboots? Im thinking ill be on crampons or skis nearly the whole time.''

I have seen mixed results. I have seen some folks that said their feet were too cold in their AT boots above 17k on summit day and had to turn back. Others have made it. I guess I'd ask myself if my feet run cold and if it's worth risking making the summit because of the boots.

2_climbaxes wrote:

timfoltz wrote:also, i have seen a lot of debate as to the best way to set up your sled. Has anyone tried cutting and fixing ski skins to the bottom to prevent the sled from pulling back on you when your stopped and then reversing the skins for coming down to prevent the sled of the last person from riding up on you? Thoughts?

Thanks,
Tim

I'd second what someone else said, I would NOT take the sled past 11 Camp. None of the guides do that, I wonder why...they might just know what they are doing.

Wrong. All the guides take sleds to 14.

My guided trip is May calls for sleds to 14;. Scott

I'll 2nd most of the beta below. If you go with TAT for your flight to the glacier (and you should) then you can use their bunkhouses in Talkeetna for free saving you some money. Fuel was $10 per gallon this past season. Sleds can be borrowed at basecamp as part of your permit. Just bring enough cords to rig your sled. Cheers!

grammys11 wrote:Sled to 14 is a must, otherwise you will have another 1-3 days of backcarry/caches. As it is, you will probably cache above windy corner, come back to 11 and then push to 14...

Overboots work well. K2 Superlight from Forty Below is a great overboot...

As for costs, here's what I remember - permit (~$250), flight onto the glacier (~$600)...

Hotel in Talkeetna - Swiss Alaska Inn - best place up there - ~$50/night and hot water and no mosquitoes!!! You can also get a 15 passenger van ride to and from Anchorage. It costs ~$75 each way...

I climbed the West Butt in 2000, unguided with two friends. When we first went through Windy Corner in mid-May it was angled blue ice and nobody was taking a sled around it. People were belaying around it. On the way down around June 2nd it was flat and snowy and boot holes all over - you could drive a truck around it. Things change. There are no rules.

We did double carrys 11k-14k. They were fine and that was standard practice then. They help your acclimatisation, were short days, and if you find this too tough then how you gonna go 14k-17k with a full pack?

D

I'd take a sled to 14.
We did not. When we decided to go down early, we could not carry all our gear/food in a single push. Couldn't give the food away.
We were lucky and found someone who had a sled we could put our extra gear/food into for the descent.
Otherwise we would have been back-carrying on the way home. Yuk.

went twice. took sled to 14 twice. going around windy corner was a pain in the a**, twice. But it is relatively short section. If i went again, i would take sled to 14 again. And pack it a little better. also , we took the sleds for the second carry only though, the first carry we did with packs only.

At the end of the day, personal preference. no big deal either way. don't sweat it.

Haliku wrote:If you go with TAT for your flight to the glacier (and you should) then you can use their bunkhouses in Talkeetna for free saving you come money.

I'll 2nd the recommendation for TAT and saving some coin on lodging in Talkeetna.

Merry Christmas everybody!

Here's my 2 cents worth regarding sled use between 11K and 14K on Denali: In good conditions an experienced team will have an easier time with sleds, but only slightly so. It is faster getting out of camp when you don't have to rig sleds and your loads on the carry and moving camp will be a little lighter if you just leave the sleds at 11k. If you are making three carries to 14K or feel your pack is too heavy with no sled when you leave 14K for home, then you brought too much stuff and/or you should be in better shape.

Everyone struggles with sleds on icy traverses and some REALLY struggle, so if you hear there is bare ice on the route, leave the sleds at 11K.

Finally, there are numerous crevasses adjacent to and crossing the route between 11K and 14K. Drifting snow often hides these and crevasse falls are common in this area. Crevasse rescue can be much more difficult when there are sleds on the rope.

Bottom line: Experienced teams are usually flexible about sled use and make the decision to use them above 11K after they assess the conditions and the abilities of their team-mates. Less experienced teams should probably cache the sleds at 11K.

Damien Gildea wrote:I climbed the West Butt in 2000, unguided with two friends. When we first went through Windy Corner in mid-May it was angled blue ice and nobody was taking a sled around it. People were belaying around it. On the way down around June 2nd it was flat and snowy and boot holes all over - you could drive a truck around it. Things change. There are no rules.

We did double carrys 11k-14k. They were fine and that was standard practice then. They help your acclimatisation, were short days, and if you find this too tough then how you gonna go 14k-17k with a full pack?

D

Agree with Damien. We did the West Butt in 2003, also undguided with friends, no sleds to 14K. Like Damien says, it's a good idea to do a double carry anyway from 11K to 14K camp for acclimatization. Also, if the return conditions change from snow to blue ice on Windy corner a sled can be a danger on descent.

Depending on the size of your group you can do a carry one day to 14, then return to 11. The next push only take one sled per rope team to 14. It will make it much easier to get all the gear down when you leave the mountain. We had two teams of 3 per rope and took one sled each on our move day to 14. Cheers!

I am sure that everyone's mileage will vary, but our team left the sleds (and snowshoes) at 11K and went with slightly heavier double carries to 14K. The slope of Windy Corner would have made the sleds real awkward. For the return we put extra (clothing) gear in a large duffel bag (which got a bit ripped up) and drug it behind the middle person (me) attached to the rope to keep it from sliding down too much.

Drag bags are very useful......otherwise make sure that the sled is packed with a lo center of gravity.